Monday, December 01, 2008

Tumble Dryer Again

A lot of people commented on the Tumble Dryer story I posted last week. Many were surprised that I admitted to having a tumble dryer. Simon Sherlock said "I'm astonished anybody can afford to run a tumble dryer at the moment, and amazed that Mel even considers one." And Compostwoman said "We don't have one...never have , never will..we dry stuff on the line OR in the house and if it looks wet, I don't wash stuff until another day."

But others were pleased I had written about it. Lizzie said "I felt a lot less naughty for occasional use of the tumble drier when I read your post Melanie. I cant dry on radiators at the moment as that would involve putting the heating on, which we havn't so far this year." and Anonymous said "It's easy for those who don't use tumble driers to feel smug - however consider that other people's life styles, house size, family size might make life more difficult for them to do this"

If people can dry their clothes without using electricity then obviously that's great. It's great for the environment, it's great for their finances, it's great for their clothes too - nothing feels or smells the same as line-dried clothes.

But for some people (me, for example, and several Bean Sprouts readers too) it's not an option all the time. And I guess for some people it's not an option any of the time. I don't feel bad about this. I do other things for the environment and for my bills. I am confident that I am doing what I can do. And I keep trying to learn more and do more to do my bit to live more sustainably on the planet.

I'm thinking of changing the tagline on this blog to "Bean Sprouts - Greener Than Thou". Just kidding. I'm actually thinking of changing it to "Bean Sprouts - You Don't Have To Do Everything". You don't have to do everything. You just have to do something. You don't have to live in a cave. You don't have to go about in damp clothes if there's just no green way for you to dry them. You don't have to save the planet single-handedly. And you don't have to feel bad about the things other people do that aren't practical for you. There's almost certainly something you do that they don't do, anyway. It's not a competition to see who's greenest. What it is, is a feeling of personal responsibility that I should do my bit. And I do, so my occasional use of the tumble dryer doesn't bother me.


Zoë said...

:: holds hands up ::

I bought a new one at the weekend after a 2 week debate with myself, should I get the current one repaired AGAIN, or should I invest in a newer, more economical, eco-friendly one. In the end I went for the latter, with any luck it should arrive tomorrow!

Gid said...

We tumble dry everything.. we have to.. SWMBO suffers terribly from hayfever so drying clothes in the open air is not an option for her.. that being said, you're quite right Mel.. we don't all have to do everything.. it's just as good if we all do what we reasonably can..

Z said...

A friend said loftily, years ago, that she has never possessed a tumble drier and thinks they are wasteful. I mentioned the laundry lines she has in her huge utility/boiler room, which is much larger than my kitchen. I can't put a pulley system up in the kitchen as the ceilings are only 2 metres high. I don't have central heating, and don't heat the upstairs rooms in my house, though there is a storage heater in the hall. I don't feel in the least guilty about using a tumble drier all through the winter.

Green Gordon said...

The allergies issue is a good point, but I can't understand why air-drying wouldn't otherwise be possible. I live in a small flat in chilly Edinburgh, and I'm watching my clothes dry as I write this...

Melanie Rimmer said...

Green Gordon - if you're watching your clothes dry at 3:43 on a Monday afternoon, then I'm assuming you either work from home or you're presently not working. For people who work outside the home, weekends are the only time they can line-dry. Based on the fact you look pretty young in your photo, and that you can't see why line-drying might be difficult for some people, I'm also assuming you don't have children. Imagine a family of 5 in which both parents work outside the home, and perhaps you can see why drying clothes at weekends only might not be an option.

Sol said...

I am wondering if one of those washing lines that you can retract would be good for the bathroom? you know the ones that go over the bath...

I try and dry outside and this weekend I have tried to dry on the clothes horse in the garage. Unfortunately this didnt work this weekend and to get the clothes clean for work, I tumble dried (with the balls previously mentioned in Bean Sprouts posts)

I wrangle with this type of thing lots. but console myself that we only have one car. So we are trying?!?!

Anonymous said...

Well said, Melanie. You put your arguments succinctly and well. As for "It's not a competition", I believe that this should apply to life in general. Unfortunately, a great part of the world doesn't seem to agree, hence so much of the strife and misery contained therein.

Robj98168 said...

Here here- You don't have to Do Everything- about time some one said it! It gets frustrating reaading one blog after another. "How to fry a chicken- First you go out and forge a skillet" Luckily you guys and gals on that side of the pond don't have to put up with Martha Stewart, but she is really the cause of mass hysteria over here.

Simon Sherlock said...

Fair enough comments from everybody I think. On a slightly different note the one thing I can't escape is ironing. It has to be one of the most wasteful pastimes both in energy and time yet we all (well most) have to do it.

Are there any green alternatives (other than look like an American and walk around looking like you slept in your shirt!)? :))

Unknown said...

I hope you didn't think I was getting at you with my comment that I have had washing stuck on the line for 2 years due to the rain. I was trying to point out that it hasn't been drying weather in places for that long. I used to have a tumble drier (or 2), but they died before I moved here. There is no room in the house for 1, so I have to do as best I can & it's very hard, even with just 2 of us to dry for. When I wash for the Travellers I always say that I can't dry & they'll get their clothes & bedding back wet ~ they can dry better than I can! Maybe I should carry my wet washing down to their warm, dry trailers... Believe me, if I could afford it & had the space, I'd use 1! I was trying to back you up in my cack-handed, clumsy way

Debs said...

Another element to this debate is to buy one of the few 'A' rated tumble dryers on the market. We've used British made White Knight (bought for <£200 at the Co-op) for years - its great in the winter in the wet west of Scotland. Of course line drying is best but we can't always do that.

Cottage Smallholder said...

I am astonished by the need to make this post and some of the responses to your original one.

Simon is lucky. He has a conservatory. If the sun shines for few hours during winter days, he is in clover even if it doesn't heat his conservatory.

In summer we hang our clothes on the washing line in the garden.
In winter we drape them over the radiators, on a drying rack or over the woodburing stove. Along with duvet covers and sheets.

But radiators are not nearly so efficient when swathed in wet clothes.

And there are just two of us here not a family.

When the heating is not on, it takes 2 days to dry the wash. If you have a conservatory you are very lucky indeed.

If we had children we would need a tumble drier to dry the family washing. Washing always needs airing and if you are cutting back on hot water then the airing cupboard is not particularly warm so that can take extra days.

Using a tumble drier might in the end be greener than not using one!

Danny tossed mine out years ago as ‘far to expensive to run’ but I can dream ;)

Lesley said...

I absolutely agee with you about not having to do EVERYTHING!

On a tangent, I buy my vegetables from a local farmer who comnes to my door every week. I love having the local organic stuff... and love the fact that I am back to eating seasonally.

However, a friend criticised me recently when I admitted that I do also occasionally purchase colourful peppers and tomatoes in the depths of winter.

At first I felt a bit guilty .... then I thought again.... why should I be criticised?

Whose life am I living, anyway?

We all have to live our own lives, doing the best we wish to or can do 'for the planet'.

But we do not have to wear hair shirts all the time to please the 'watchdogs'

So....You enjoy your tumble dryer... heaven knows, with a house full of kids and the kind of summers we get in the UK, you need it!

Neil said...

I probably don't appreciate how much washing a family of 5 produces, but I do see a tumble drier as a very non-eco item.

I suppose the real question is how much energy does it actually use relative to everything else. i.e. whether it should be a top-target in cutting your home energy use.

I've been measuring our enery readings recently and now the heating is on, it is clear that is by far the biggest energy user in our house - approx 60-70% if my base assumptions are correct. And it's still cold. So next is figuring out insulation options.

Frankie said...

I had a tumble dryer delivered today after two years without. I could continue without but Spouse does not like his Y-fronts displayed on the radiators. I've also ordered a microwave after over a decade without. No guilt allowed in this house :)

Anonymous said...


Your blog is mentioned in Feedback column of NewScientist re: laundry balls :).

We also have tumble - essential when the washing line in winter doesn't get much sun, and currently we have been getting a lot of rain again.

Anonymous said...

This is from one of those "wrinkled Americans" and is in answer to Simon Sherlock's ironing dilemma. Another benefit of the tumble dryer is that if you take the clothes out promptly, you don't HAVE to iron. And I don't mean that to sound snarky. I agree with Mel- we don't have to do everything. We just have to do what we can.

themanicgardener said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
themanicgardener said...

Wow. Another wrinkled American here, though as I almost always wear knits, it doesn't show too badly--or so I like to believe.

I didn't take the time to check on ALL the people who have commented here, but aside from the one who declared him/herself American (but remained otherwise anonymous, and I can see why!) this conversation has to have been conducted almost entirely by Brits, because virtually every American (and Canadian too, I think) who owns a home also owns a clothes dryer and uses it routinely. It's part of our just deserts, you know, as the most powerwful blah blah etcetera.

I think a lot of people here would be bowled over to think that those in an industrialized country still dry their clothes on lines, radiators, and so on.

For the wrinkle-conscious amongst us: I find, (and someone else mentioned this recently somewhere also) that a quick stint in the dryer removes most wrinkles (for those wearing button-down shirts); then they go on hangers in the basement, and come out good enough for this side of the Atlantic, anyway.

I wish the energy/financial crunch here would hit hard enough so people did have to give up dryers, but they'd probably revolt first.

Anonymous said...

"it's just as good if we all do what we reasonably can" - surely not true. We almost certainly have to do a whole lot more than we are doing, even if everyone joins in.

Debbie said...

I personally balance the fact that I use a drier which uses electricity and NOT using an iron so therefore saving electricity ;) I rarely iron anything in winter. Quick tumble (half heat) shake and fold. All done! Infact I rarely iron anything in summer either 0-;
Draping things on radiators is an awful waste of heat.

Anonymous said...

We have a tumbledryer and try to be responsible with the use of it; e.g. I'll try and line dry things when the weather permits, or put them out on the airers and give them a quick tumble at the end to stop that not-so-lovely crispy/bobbled effect.

It's just about moderation, about doing what you can when you can. And if you can make provisions to be a true self-sufficient 'purist', then fine. But not everybody can all the time, in reality. We're not perfect, but even if every single person in the world did as much as you in terms of trying to live the 'good life' and being green, we'd all be in a much better position.

chaiselongue said...

I absolutely agree with you! No one can save the planet single-handedly. If you have a family and live in a cold damp climate what else can you do? It's very bad for the house to dry clothes on radiators anyway - all that damp has to go somewhere! I'm lucky that we live in a dry climate and hardly ever use a tumble dryer now, but when we lived in Wales, with children, in winter ... we had to!

Mark Lee said...

Making "tsk tsk" noises of disapprobation is noise pollution, pure and simple.

Great post.

Alan said...


We have tried both line drying and tumble dryers in different locations, and even in the desert south west where there should be no problem drying clothes outside we often opted for the tumble due to allergies. The way forward isn't about giving up conveniences or technology, it is about how creative we can be in having what we want in a sustainable way. Don't compromise, but keep moving forward.

Neil said...

Dryer vs iron question

Another option I hadn't heard but came across while browsing is the closet drier - a dehumidifier in a cupboard. Though I really can't see how it can be true that it "Takes up less space".

Neil said...

BTW - I would be very interested in peoples average home energy use.

e.g. Since end of October we have been using about 49kWH each day in gas (heating, hot water and hobs) and about 9.5kWH each day for electricity (inc oven). Which is an average power use of about 2.5kW.

It would be interesting to hear how that compares with other people.

BTW: 1 gas unit = 31.34kWH

Just take regular meter readings (weekly/monthly) and then you can work out the figures from there.

Compostwoman said...

As someone whose initial comment was quoted in this follow up post,

I feel rather surprised at apparently being viewed by commenters as somehow being critical of you on your first post...I didn't, and I wasn't...I simply made a factual comment about the fact we don't have a drier.

No critisism of you or anyone else was stated or implied.

I don't judge other people's green habits as I don't know their circumstances.

And I don't really expect other people to judge me on comments I didn't actually make.

I chose not to have a drier, other people chose to have one. Thats all I was saying.

Anonymous said...

Under no circumstances would I give up my tumble dryer, and I don't particularly care if it's wasteful to use it. Drying the laundry for seven people on a daily basis is far from easy, and I see no reason to make it any harder.

I notice that no one has yet claimed to do all their family washing by hand - if folk aren't prepared to give up washing machines, why on earth should the rest of us be made to feel guilty because we choose to get our laundry dry after washing it?

Sometimes it seems to me that the 'green brigade' just want to be 'holier than thou', but can't be bothered to think it through.

I don't do as much for the environment as other people here, but I do have my good points. There are several areas of my life in which I might get a higher 'green' score than other folk. Laundry, however, is never likely to be one such.


Anonymous said...

Here here! I have to use my tumble dryer for two main reasons. 1. My son is autistic and we've noticed a marked problem when he wears line dried clothes. His OT suggested that the clothes were stiffer and scratchier that way and likely bothered his over sensitive skin.

and 2. The dog goes in the same area as the line and on days without a breeze the clothes end up smelling like dog poo.

Neil said...

@Fran - I agree it can get over the top, but isn't there is a huge difference between energy used by a dryer and the energy used by a washer - I didn't think they were comparable in terms of going green?

I'll try to dig up some figures to see if this is perception or reality.

Neil said...

OK, some energy figures for washing machines vs tumble driers as promised.

According to
An A rated washing machine uses 40°C wash uses 0.56 kWh per cycle

It was more difficult finding numbers for Tumble driers and more confusing as it can vary a lot depending on which cycle is used. However I finally found -
(I've relabelled/reformatted to account for losing the table formatting.)

Energy consumption in kWh/kg (x)
Class A x <= 0.51
Class B 0.51 < x <= 0.59
Class C 0.59 < x <= 0.67

Table 3 Vented dryers’ maximum energy consumption, kWh per class
Class A 5kg=2.6 6kg=3.1 7kg=3.6
Class B 5kg=3.0 6kg=3.5 7kg=4.1
Class C 5kg=3.4 6kg=4.0 7kg=4.7

So based on those figures (and the one report was talking about changing them) I think you would use about 5-7 times more energy to dry the clothes than you would to wash them. Even with an A rated appliance, which apparently can be A-rated just for one of it's programs e.g. the super efficient 7 hour one.

Blicky Kitty said...

Oh I love your posts! I think it should be a contest and the loser gets flogged -- just kidding. I've been blogging about silly stuff lately, but you're inspiring me to blog more about the things I care about again...oh and I think I'm getting chickens because of you! Oh I hope I'm a good chicken mumma. I did post a review a while back of Thomas Friedman's book that might interest you (the link to his interview, not what I had to say about it).

The thing he said that struck me was: "Be a work in progress. None of us are perfect." You make such a wonderful contribution because you encourage people to do things they might not have considered (like being a chicken mumma) in a positive way.

Blicky Kitty said...

hahah Simon, I just read the comments.

I don't iron. I wish I were an American who doesn't iron for environmental reasons, but alas I'm an american who is too lazy to iron (and usually doesn't make it out of pajamas until the school bus rolls by).

Anonymous said...

A most interesting debate - Each to their own as far as I'm concerned - unless you're living as a hunter gatherer in a cave its unlikely you're not impacting negatively on the planet to some degree surely?

I don't use a dryer as I like using a line (and with only 2 of us and not much rain it's usually easy enough). Not sure I'd think the same if I had more bods to wash for.

I hand washed for about 9 months due to a lack of electricity and plumbing and have to say it was not something I hope to go back to ever no matter how green and friendly I felt doing it.

I never iron because I hate it, we don't have much leccy and I don't think I need to. Hang stuff up long enough and it tends to end up pretty flat. Just don't leave crumpled washing in machines, dryers or baskets - fold quickly at all points between machine and drawer/wardrobe for lovely flat clothes.

Ladybird World Mother said...

I would kill for a tumble drier. We had one and it died. Quite dramatically too...drum fell off! Anyway... 2 years swear a lot and wash a lot and wait for the sun to come out. Have pulley thing so am OK for one wash at a time.
Spose it saves energy and all, and that feels nice. But Oh, to be able to watch those undies going round and round without having to Peg Each And Every One Up On The Line.

Anonymous said...

Neil - I fear your calculations have whooshed over my head, because I am a Bear Of Little Brain and I don't understand such things.

At least two wash-loads get done here each day. It would take around half an hour to peg everything out on the line, and the same again to get it in again when it was dry. That's if it got dry, of course. Or I could spend most of the day shifting things around on radiators in a vain effort to get yesterday's school uniform ready for tomorrow.

I don't care to take that amount of time just dealing with laundry, however, so I throw everything into the tumble dryer and press the 'on' switch. An hour or so later everything's ready to be folded and put wherever it has to go.

I'm sorry if I don't care too much about the amount of energy I use to dry my family's clothes, bedding, towels etc... there are other things that are far more important to me than doing laundry.

I'll be 'green' in other ways perhaps: I drive an economical car; I don't fly abroad for holidays; my children walk to school; I shop locally - small things, but they add up. Stuff like laundry is a chore, and I want an easy life.


Compostwoman said...

I have a small child. So there are three of us in our household.

We also live in a very mucky, rural environment and we often get dirty doing what we do with hens, garden, wood etc...

I *still* only do 3 or 4 loads of laundry a week!

Why are so many people doing so much washing?

Surely life is too short for THAT?

To me, laundry is just one of the many "small things" which count and add up when done only when needed? just like using the car less, turning off stuff on standby, shopping locally, recycling.

Something to be done when needed?

Neil said...

Agreed, we all make savings or use resources up in different ways.

I can't imagine doing 2+ wash loads a day, every day!!

BTW - Does anyone else have any energy figures for their house?

Blicky Kitty said...

Mel I left you a little virtual something under the Blicky Kitty Christmas tree. :)

Mam said...

Hello Mel. I wish I had a tumbler! I have enough space to line dry including the original pulley thing in my kitchen so DH won't let me have one. My clothes are permanently stiff compared with the good old days :-)))

Griffin said...

I live in Washington State, PLUS live in an apartment. So limited space on top of constant raining and high humidity.

Without a tumble dryer, I wouldn't be able to do laundry at all.

I keep my dryer's lint trap washed and detail the lint-trap holder on occasion so I dry things in half the time as before. The electricity savings I get from other things also completely covers the cost of the dryer.

I personally see nothing wrong with having to use a dryer. We don't all live in a warm climate and we don't all have the time/space to even let it hang there.

And to have it warm enough in my apt to dry the clothes, I'd have to turn all three small heaters on high and be uncomfortably hot before they'd even dry. So it's more wasteful for me to line-dry than to tumble-dry.

People need to realize that every circumstance is different and not cast judgement.

mac-a-matic said...

Why agonise about using a tumble drier when there's a perfectly good solar powered unit that works on any rotary washing line? It's called the Rotaire Dryline and I heard about it on the Chris Evans Radio Show - I wouldn't be without it!
Try googling Rotaire...

mac-a-matic said...

Why agonise about using a tumble drier when there's a perfectly good solar powered unit that works on any rotary washing line? It's called the Rotaire Dryline and I heard about it on the Chris Evans Radio Show - I wouldn't be without it!
Try googling Rotaire...

mac-a-matic said...

Why agonise about using a tumble drier when there's a perfectly good solar powered one? It's called the Rotaire Dryline and it fits on any rotary washing line - I heard about it on the Chris Evans Radio 2 Show. I wouldn't be without it! It will cost you nothing to run.
Try Googling Rotaire...

Anonymous said...

Thanks for this - I've been feeling very guilty about using our tumble dryer when things have been in the spare room for weeks resolutely not drying. I must set about getting a new washing line though - the metal prongs on our old one fell to pieces in my hands.

Unknown said...

many of us live in apartments and can't hand anything dry. We must also have gardens in containers and support farmers instead of rasing chickens. We try though! anyone interested in local living should check out these cool sites.

mac-a-matic said...

For those people living in apartments the Rotaire Dryline is not an option, but for all the rest of us, why waste energy to achieve something that will happen anyway, provided the washing doesn't get wet by rain?

I hear Rotaire are working on an invention to do the same for apartment dwellers.

Philippa D said...

For those anti-tumble dryer folk you might be interested in this
from the Time to Change website that encourages the replacement of 15.4 million old, energy-hungry, domestic appliances still in use in the UK.
Gas tumble dryers are pretty green!

Philippa D said...

By the way there is a competition on Time to Change website to win an energy efficient fridge (A+ or A++). If you are 18 or over and think you own the oldest fridge in the UK, you can enter on

Anonymous said...

I heard about that washing line too 'mac-a-mac'.
For more great ideas and sustainable alternatives to everyday options you should visit UK AWARE 09 or see the website

Anonymous said...

Some times I wonder what nonsense people will come up with next. Would they like to un-invent the wheel? Anyone who lives in a wet climate as I do (N Ireland) has no choice but to use a tumble dryer, otherwise their washing would never get dried. When it rains almost every day who would want their radiators festooned day after day with clothes, bedding, etc.? Not me, that's for sure. Especially with two lively cats in the house, climbing all over the newly washed articles - or maybe I should get rid of the cats? Soon the zealots will be chasing us off to wash our clothes in the nearest stream, pounding them with rocks.

No, honestly, I really wish people would leave the use of modern technology to the individual, as one person's needs are not the same as another's. I'd rather do my bit for the planet in my own way than be dragooned into following someone else's instructions as to how to live my life. IMO neither tumble dryers nor irons are 'evil' things - they're simply two of the many modern appliances that make our lives a little bit easier and pleasant. I'm not wasteful of electricity (I can't afford to be) and so I won't let anyone make me feel guilty about using appliances that mean I don't have to wear stiff, wrinkled, rough-dried clothing.

Lesley said...

All of this discussion has given my washer/dryer ideas above its station and it has packed up after 15 years. It is sad to see a long friendship die! It left yesterday in a big white van without even a backward glance

mac-a-matic said...

I have used a Rotaire Dryline for over a year and it has removed the laundry from the house and put it in the fresh air where it belongs. If it rains it still dries; if it is freezing some of the water freezes and shakes off (hard core activity though). I have to take it down in high winds and snow but otherwise it lives on the airer. It is on display at the Centre for Alternative Technology in Wales, and if it's good enough for them it must work.

No-one is trying to impose change on you tumble-driers, but one day you may realise that there are major changes under way globally that are better met head-on rather than denied. Any radically new invention will take time to emerge into the mainstream: only 1% of buyers are innovators, and only 3% are early adoptors. There is no blame involved. In America most people are not ALLOWED to dry their clothes outside - I am fighting for my rights.

Neil said...

@Dimsie - There is a huge difference between the energy use of a tumble drier and a washing machine - they are not in any way similar. People aren't trying to get you to give up your washing machine, but it is very easy to see a tumble drier as wasteful and excessive.

Just because the technology exists, does not mean we have to use it without regard for the impact. On the other hand very few people are anywhere near perfect and everyone has different excesses.

So you may feel you have to use a tumble drier but it is still a device that is seen as wastefull and not very green.

Anonymous said...

This is really funny.

mac-a-matic said...

I can understand people thinking it funny, but I had cause to research the amount of energy used by tumble driers each year, and the amount of CO2 generated as a result. I found that it costs about £100 at current prices and in the UK amounts to 10.6 million megawatts of electricity and 14.5 million tonnes of CO2. Amazing, isn't it? Across the EU that amounts to about 45 million tonnes of CO2. The answer is to use natural energy if possible, although I understand there are many reasons why it may not be possible. We use a Rotaire Dryline to cover our rotary line, and it works well for us.

Z said...

Yes, mac-a-matic, so you keep saying, but you're advertising your own product and so are not at all disinterested. I have visited your website and watched your video a couple of times, but whilst your cover might be useful in light rain for drying my smalls (which I don't mind draping on a radiator anyway) I am afraid I don't fancy dashing out in a downpour to dodge under a not-quite-high enough cover and hang up sheets and towels. Then, fetching them back again in the rain, and maybe the wind, they will get damp. You've a good idea but I doubt that it's going to hit the mass market yet.

Lesley said...

Macamatic clearly does not live in Wales where rain comes in horizontally, not vertically!

Isn't it lovely to have a few sunny days so the washing can dry outside in the sunshine!?

mac-a-matic said...

Hi Z and Lesley, I invented the Dryline and I am proud that hundreds of people like using it. I know Wales well, and if the Centre for Alternative Technology in Macchylleth is satisfied to have displayed it for over a year it clearly works in Wales. They have a reputation to maintain.
As for the facts of energy use, they are real and persuasive. You can't please everyone, so enjoy doing your laundry the way you do.

Z said...

Dear Mac, doing the laundry is anything but enjoyable.

Not fair to hijack Mel's site so I'll leave a comment on yours. Indeed, I think it would be great if everyone would visit your blog and see what you're talking about and I hope they do.

Anonymous said...

I really don't believe it rains all the time - even in Wales.

However I do agree with Z that mac-a-matic should not hijack Mel's site.

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